Assessing our squad

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dozer
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Fuck the Glazers wrote: 7 months ago Seems like these quotes are legit

It's Rojo mate. No one would have played him.
Fuck the Glazers
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dozer wrote: 7 months ago
Fuck the Glazers wrote: 7 months ago Seems like these quotes are legit

It's Rojo mate. No one would have played him.
He's an average to good CB which means he's a cut above Harry

Ole really was a yes man who was not willing to rock the boat - not just with the big players but also the board & owners. The perfect shield for Ed and the Glazers. A United fan and legend living his dream.
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Jason
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Fuck the Glazers wrote: 7 months ago
dozer wrote: 7 months ago
Fuck the Glazers wrote: 7 months ago Seems like these quotes are legit

It's Rojo mate. No one would have played him.
He's an average to good CB which means he's a cut above Harry

Ole really was a yes man who was not willing to rock the boat - not just with the big players but also the board & owners. The perfect shield for Ed and the Glazers. A United fan and legend living his dream.
Still a better manager than Frank or stevie g, but neither have been ridiculed to the level as ole was.
Fuck the Glazers
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Jason wrote: 7 months ago
Fuck the Glazers wrote: 7 months ago
dozer wrote: 7 months ago
Fuck the Glazers wrote: 7 months ago Seems like these quotes are legit

It's Rojo mate. No one would have played him.
He's an average to good CB which means he's a cut above Harry

Ole really was a yes man who was not willing to rock the boat - not just with the big players but also the board & owners. The perfect shield for Ed and the Glazers. A United fan and legend living his dream.
Still a better manager than Frank or stevie g, but neither have been ridiculed to the level as ole was.
Not gonna dispute that. He's the only manager post Fergie to get back to back top 4 finishes too. He still worked well within the confines.
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bman2
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Jason wrote: 7 months ago
Fuck the Glazers wrote: 7 months ago
dozer wrote: 7 months ago
Fuck the Glazers wrote: 7 months ago Seems like these quotes are legit

It's Rojo mate. No one would have played him.
He's an average to good CB which means he's a cut above Harry

Ole really was a yes man who was not willing to rock the boat - not just with the big players but also the board & owners. The perfect shield for Ed and the Glazers. A United fan and legend living his dream.
Still a better manager than Frank or stevie g, but neither have been ridiculed to the level as ole was.
Yeah I was against Ole having the permanent job because he just didn’t have the CV, and nothing that happened during his tenure, even the good moments, made me reconsider. But it’s so obvious that he was a fuck lot more successful than other recent-PL-players-turned-managers, and the pundits never treated him fairly.
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Felwin
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For me Ten Hag has put Ole's time into perspective. I was fully behind him too and desperately wanted him to succeed. He kept a happy camp and invoked good spirits for derbies and other big games.

But now we can see what having a proper coach does in the modern game. The way Ten Hag managed the League Cup final and that Barcelona tie. Ole wouldn't have been able to. It's the most tinpot cup United can win (apart from the Conference League which we hopefully won't have to worry about for a few seasons....), but it's still an achievement and coaching and tactics come into it. Especially with our squad where it's even more important.

You lot are right as well. He gets lumped in with Gerrard and Lampard but they're much worse. Can't think of a single signature win for either of them. The way Emery has show what's possible with Villa and Lampard makes every team slightly worse. Ole improved us but hit a ceiling fairly fast.
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dozer
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Felwin wrote: 7 months ago For me Ten Hag has put Ole's time into perspective. I was fully behind him too and desperately wanted him to succeed. He kept a happy camp and invoked good spirits for derbies and other big games.

But now we can see what having a proper coach does in the modern game. The way Ten Hag managed the League Cup final and that Barcelona tie. Ole wouldn't have been able to. It's the most tinpot cup United can win (apart from the Conference League which we hopefully won't have to worry about for a few seasons....), but it's still an achievement and coaching and tactics come into it. Especially with our squad where it's even more important.

You lot are right as well. He gets lumped in with Gerrard and Lampard but they're much worse. Can't think of a single signature win for either of them. The way Emery has show what's possible with Villa and Lampard makes every team slightly worse. Ole improved us but hit a ceiling fairly fast.
Ten hag methods are passing the eye test. That's it.
In terms of results he's not doing better than Ole yet.
He's showing a lot more potential though and that's key. But that's the extent of credit he must get.

In terms of goals we're very short. We've only scored 49 so far with 6 games to go.
We scored 73 goals in the league in Ole's penultimate season where we finished second. We scored 66 in the season prior.
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Felwin
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dozer wrote: 7 months ago
Felwin wrote: 7 months ago For me Ten Hag has put Ole's time into perspective. I was fully behind him too and desperately wanted him to succeed. He kept a happy camp and invoked good spirits for derbies and other big games.

But now we can see what having a proper coach does in the modern game. The way Ten Hag managed the League Cup final and that Barcelona tie. Ole wouldn't have been able to. It's the most tinpot cup United can win (apart from the Conference League which we hopefully won't have to worry about for a few seasons....), but it's still an achievement and coaching and tactics come into it. Especially with our squad where it's even more important.

You lot are right as well. He gets lumped in with Gerrard and Lampard but they're much worse. Can't think of a single signature win for either of them. The way Emery has show what's possible with Villa and Lampard makes every team slightly worse. Ole improved us but hit a ceiling fairly fast.
Ten hag methods are passing the eye test. That's it.
In terms of results he's not doing better than Ole yet.
He's showing a lot more potential though and that's key. But that's the extent of credit he must get.

In terms of goals we're very short. We've only scored 49 so far with 6 games to go.
We scored 73 goals in the league in Ole's penultimate season where we finished second. We scored 66 in the season prior.
Right, but Hag is starting from the lowest base of any manager since Fergie. They were shot to fuck and had Ronaldo weighing everything down. Ole's job was fairly simple when he came in - don't be Mourinho. Not to take away from what he did but Jose was such a clear problem for that team and they showed what was possible after we finally got rid of him.

We've also played most of the campaign without a striker and there's the age old problem of comparing seasons. Makes no sense to do it like that. Especially when Ole had Lukaku, Cavani, Greenwood, an actually fit half decent Martial, Bruno as a second striker. Much more goals in his teams.

Hag gets a moody past it Ronaldo, Rashford with big question marks (at the start of the season), a non-existant Martial, Bruno more as a number 10 or out wide and Weghorst.
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dozer
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Felwin wrote: 7 months ago
dozer wrote: 7 months ago
Felwin wrote: 7 months ago For me Ten Hag has put Ole's time into perspective. I was fully behind him too and desperately wanted him to succeed. He kept a happy camp and invoked good spirits for derbies and other big games.

But now we can see what having a proper coach does in the modern game. The way Ten Hag managed the League Cup final and that Barcelona tie. Ole wouldn't have been able to. It's the most tinpot cup United can win (apart from the Conference League which we hopefully won't have to worry about for a few seasons....), but it's still an achievement and coaching and tactics come into it. Especially with our squad where it's even more important.

You lot are right as well. He gets lumped in with Gerrard and Lampard but they're much worse. Can't think of a single signature win for either of them. The way Emery has show what's possible with Villa and Lampard makes every team slightly worse. Ole improved us but hit a ceiling fairly fast.
Ten hag methods are passing the eye test. That's it.
In terms of results he's not doing better than Ole yet.
He's showing a lot more potential though and that's key. But that's the extent of credit he must get.

In terms of goals we're very short. We've only scored 49 so far with 6 games to go.
We scored 73 goals in the league in Ole's penultimate season where we finished second. We scored 66 in the season prior.
Right, but Hag is starting from the lowest base of any manager since Fergie. They were shot to fuck and had Ronaldo weighing everything down. Ole's job was fairly simple when he came in - don't be Mourinho. Not to take away from what he did but Jose was such a clear problem for that team and they showed what was possible after we finally got rid of him.

We've also played most of the campaign without a striker and there's the age old problem of comparing seasons. Makes no sense to do it like that. Especially when Ole had Lukaku, Cavani, Greenwood, an actually fit half decent Martial, Bruno as a second striker. Much more goals in his teams.

Hag gets a moody past it Ronaldo, Rashford with big question marks (at the start of the season), a non-existant Martial, Bruno more as a number 10 or out wide and Weghorst.
Those sound similar to the excuses made by the Pogba apologists. He's not starting from the lowest base. Every manager has bought players according to their system. Ten hag has spent the most among our managers in a single summer window including a free transfer in Eriksen and he has 2 loan signings. That's a lot of players. Getting 4th isn't that big an achievement.
And Ole's job wasn't simple lol. Its not simple following the carnage left by Jose. Just because a non manager in Rangick cost us the champs league spot it doesn't mean we have a low base. We finished second and third the seasons prior. Ole was rewarded and punished because of his results and Hag will also be judged accordingly.

"Ole had Lukaku, Cavani, Greenwood, an actually fit half decent Martial, Bruno as a second striker. Much more goals in his teams."
Martial was always crap sorry. Lukaku and Cavani weren't good enough and Ole sold Lukaku for a good fee in his first full season. Cavani didn't turn up half the time. Greenwood was potential. Ole bought Bruno.

"Hag gets a moody past it Ronaldo, Rashford with big question marks (at the start of the season), a non-existant Martial, Bruno more as a number 10 or out wide and Weghorst."
Hag handled the Ronaldo situation well, much better than Ole would have. He gets credit for Rashford. But he had Bruno, Antony (80m signing who he bought) and Weghorst. He also has Garnacho and Sancho lol. His goals return is atrocious.

We'll see next season. We have to see significant improvement next season and like Ole I expect his signings to make or break the manager. Ole's crap signings in Sancho, Beek and Bissaka cost him. Varane was injured under him too. If Hag fucks up his transfers and retains the crap for too long then he'll also lose his job. Guardiola was ruthless even with some good players. Hag has no option but to do the same.
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Felwin
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We won’t see eye to eye here, Dozer. You seem determined to paint everything that isn’t a remarkable achievement as not good enough. Our star has fallen a long way and the squad is still average and dysfunctional in several positions. Also, I was talking about strikers so your point about Sancho and Garnacho is irrelevant.

Tired of making the point but you can’t judge a manager on the actual amount of money spent. Not his fault that United pay a double premium, once for being clueless at planning/negotiating and another because everyone knows they’ll always pay up for political reasons.

I wasn’t a Pogba apologist. Same as with Sancho. There’s a fucking good player in there and I want to see him more often. I’m just being realistic. We’re stuck with a lot of these players so it’s always a compromise and Hag has done a great job finding that compromise more often than not. Another tired point but it’s not a computer game where you can just get rid of 10 and sign 10 in one window. Have to commit to a long term process of improving each position. Especially now money is a big issue.

IMO ten Hag is doing a really good job, regardless of how we finish the season. Better than I expected in all honesty. Got rid of Ronaldo, emergence of Garnacho, Martinez & Casemiro looking like proper reds, Rashford surprisingly good. A very nice recovery on last seasons awfulness. And it wasn’t on the cards in August at all.
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